Pomegranate Juice & Asprin etc.,

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K2
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 51
   Posted 2/17/2011 12:32 PM (GMT -6)   

Disclaimer: THIS IS NOT AN ADVOCACY POST!

 

It's a somewhat befuddled post from a newbie. I know this kind of stuff can be "sensitive" - no harm intended

 

Being a new PC kid my eyes are quickly opening to a maze of claims  many legitimate studies (almost always preliminary in nature) make regarding non-dx substances or actions (exercise) that aide in successful PC management.

 

Examples:

1) Take aspirin

2) Drink Pomegranate Juice

3) Exercise

4) Many, many more

 

So many of these things are easy enough to do - I even like pomegranate juice, but it seems to me these studies thus far are still fairly uncertain but serve as pointers for additional research (everyone wants a grant for additional research). Recent pomegranate juice studies are (to me) quite interesting. The recent study of POMx a.k.a Pepco Holdings Inc. has been a buz at HW ...I'm thinking, what the heck, a little juice - it doesn't get any easier than that.

 

But...of course if it does actually somehow help me I will never really know because I'll be doing many, many things (nutrition, exercise, prayer, fellowship) that specific attribution will be impossible.

 

I believe if I had previously done what I'll be doing now my chances of getting PC would probably have been very much smaller - so how can these things hurt now?

 

So for me the math goes something like this:

 

Is there a possibility of harm, to include unrealistic hope?

Is it expensive?

Is it hard to do?

Can I accept uncertain efficacy?

 

If the answers are no, no, no and yes, then why not.

 

I would do it for the same reason I exercise - no harm and the expatiation of benefit is not unreasonable.

 

Will I start washing aspirin down with Pomegranate Juice?

Maybe - I still have a lot of research to do and many things to learn from the HW vetrans.

I used to find it interesting (pre-PC) that many cancer patients bought juicers and shake ingredients that they thought would help them - I have no way of knowing if it did. At the time it I thought it seem kind of desperate. Now I thinking about buying a pomegranate juicer : )  Strange how the world turns.

 

Perhaps, it's partly the motivation, drive, mind+body connection,  and general hardy sprit of folks that keep active and keep doing what they can that make's the biggest contribution. Just go for it - as best as you can - knowing in advance there's not much that is knowable. Enjoy the day.

 

I personally have not neen able to "enjoy the day" very sucessfully as I'm still in the midst of an unfolding, statistically unkind, PC diagonisis. 

 

In northwestern china they grow a lot of pomegranates and street vendors will squeeze it fresh for you - it's kind of bitter and it’s in a thin plastic cup not a exotic potion-looking bottle.

 

Oh Yes, I would lke another glass?

 

K2

50.8 yrs, 1st PSA 12.76, DRE abnormal

Eurology appt. scheduled

Did I mention I was a nubie?


Steve n Dallas
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 4829
   Posted 2/17/2011 1:04 PM (GMT -6)   

I spend more time worring about being killed on the freeway then I do dieing of cancer.

And then there's astroids falling of the sky....Ya just never know when that might happen.

I'm eating more healthy stuff now than I did a few years ago.. Just this morning I added another lap around the block for my morning jog. Am all the way up to three miles.

 


Piano
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 847
   Posted 2/17/2011 2:35 PM (GMT -6)   
I recently starting taking aspirin and pomegranate juice with no other significant changes. My next PSA after 2 1/2 months showed no change in doubling time -- so aspirin and pom for me at this early stage has had no effect.

Of course, what works or doesn't for some may not have the same effect on others. The only way to know if something works for us is to try it and measure the results. An ounce of practise beats a pound of theory. :-)
No symptoms; PSA 5.7; Gleason 4+5=9; cancer in 4/12 cores
Non-nerve-sparing RRP 7 March 2008 age 63
Organ confined, neg margins. Gleason downgrade 4+4=8
Fully continent
Bimix worked well; now using just VED
PSA undetectable at first but now 0.4, doubling time 7 months
No radiation but ADT coming unless I can slow down the rise...

Newporter
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 225
   Posted 2/17/2011 3:48 PM (GMT -6)   
Piano,

Just curious, why no radiation?

Skate
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2010
Total Posts : 424
   Posted 2/17/2011 4:24 PM (GMT -6)   

K2

I'm off to the gym now, after just enjoying a refreshing glass of pomegranate juice.  Tastes great when it's ice cold!  Would probably be better with vodka!! Hmmm?

Skate


Age 59 at Diagnosis 62 now
01/08 PSA 4.17 DRE showed node
03/08 RP - pT3a 10% ca / Nerve Sparing, margins clear, no invasion
Continent 3 weeks post surgery / ED
06/08 until 08/09 PSA 0.01
08/09 PSA .14
09/09 SRT / 36 treatments
01/10 PSA .13
08/11/10 PSA 3.44
30/11/10 Zoladex ADT

Kongo
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2010
Total Posts : 36
   Posted 2/17/2011 6:09 PM (GMT -6)   

Men taking statins (also shown to lower the risk of PCa recurrence) should use caution when taking pomegranate juice as it interferes similar to grapefruit juice with drugs like Lipitor, Crestar, and so forth.  A good idea to check with your prescribing doctor if you're using statins before buying at case of POM at COSTCO.

I will say, from personal experience, that you can make a great pomegranate martini ... kind of like extend your PSADT and enjoy it.


Piano
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 847
   Posted 2/17/2011 6:29 PM (GMT -6)   
Newporter said...
Piano,

Just curious, why no radiation?
The docs considered that with my stats and surgical results, radiation isn't worthwhile. The horse has bolted. cry

Fairwind
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2010
Total Posts : 3741
   Posted 2/17/2011 6:35 PM (GMT -6)   
K-2..."When you got 'em by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"..

A plaque on the wall in the office of Nixon aide J.R. Haldeman...
Age 68.
PSA age 55: 3.5, DRE normal.
age 58: 4.5
61: 5.2
64: 7.5, DRE "Abnormal"
65: 8.5, " normal", biopsy, 12 core, negative...
66 9.0 "normal", 2ed biopsy, negative, BPH, Proscar
67 4.5 DRE "normal"
68 7.0 3rd biopsy positive, 4 out of 12, G-6,7, 9
RALP Sept 3 2010, pos margin, one pos vesicle nodes neg. Post Op PSA 0.9 SRT, HT. 2-15-'11 PSA 0.0

proscapt
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2010
Total Posts : 644
   Posted 2/18/2011 2:03 AM (GMT -6)   
Kongo - I checked with my doc and he said don't worry about the interaction of pom with my statin, that's it's not really like grapefruit.

Then I checked the national institute of health info and their list of diet issues for simvastatin says nothing about prostate.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000911#a692030-specialDietary
Same for Lipitor.

Then I checked wiki which lists all things you should not take with simvastatin. The list does not include pomegranate. See below. So I don't think this is a real issue.


Interactions

Grapefruit contains furanocoumarins, notably bergamottin and 6',7'-dihydroxybergamottin, which inhibit the intestinal cytochrome P450 3A4 isoform. This in turn slows metabolization of simvastatin and a large number of other drugs resulting in higher plasma levels of the drug. Due to the risk of toxicity patients taking simvastatin should avoid intake of grapefruit and grapefruit-containing products.[6]

On August 8, 2008, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) issued a warning of the risk of rhabdomyolysis, which can lead to kidney failure or death, when simvastatin is used with amiodarone. This interaction is dose-dependent with simvastatin doses exceeding 20 mg. This drug combination especially with higher doses of simvastatin should be avoided.[7]

On March 19, 2010 the FDA issued a another statement regarding simvastatin that said it increases the risk of muscle injury (myopathy) when taken at high doses (80 mg) or at lower doses in combination with other drugs. This conclusion is supported by the Study of the Effectiveness of Additional Reductions in Cholesterol and Homocysteine (SEARCH) trial.

Also, a 2010 FDA review of Simvastatin drug-drug interactions stated that patients should not take a simvastatin with Itraconazole, Ketoconazole, Erythromycin, Clarithromycin, Telithromycin, HIV protease inhibitors, or Nefazodone. Patients taking 10 mg of simvastatin should not take it with Gemfibrozil, Cyclosporine, or Danazol. If taking 20 mg of simvastatin, do not take it with Amiodarone or Verapamil. Diltiazem should not be taken with 40 mg of simvastatin. These drugs mentioned are CYP3A4 inhibitors which decrease the metabolism of simvastatin, therefore increasing the plasma activity of simvastatin which leads to higher risk of developing rhabdomyolysis and myopathy.[8] Simvastatin is contraindicated in pregnancy and liver disease.[8]

Steve n Dallas
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 4829
   Posted 2/18/2011 4:26 AM (GMT -6)   
Daily aspirin therapy: Understand the benefits and risks

Is an aspirin a day the right thing for you?
It's not as easy a decision as it sounds. Know the benefits and risks before considering daily aspirin therapy.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/daily-aspirin-therapy/HB00073

geezer99
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 990
   Posted 2/18/2011 11:31 AM (GMT -6)   
It is pretty hard to argue against going to a heart healthy diet and regular exercise (both aerobic and resistance.) Even if these have not been shown specific to PCa there are lots of other things out there for you to avoid dying from from.

For everything else -- ask your doctor. That includes aspirin as well as other supplements.

The research so far suggests that pomegranate may have some benefit and has shown few bad effects. BUT it is not a magic bullet and so, much depends on your economic situation. If the choice is spending on fresh fruits and vegetables or pomegranate, then the fruits and vegetables win easily.

F8
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 3800
   Posted 2/18/2011 12:03 PM (GMT -6)   
>>BUT it is not a magic bullet and so, much depends on your economic situation. If the choice is spending on fresh fruits and vegetables or pomegranate, then the fruits and vegetables win easily.<<
 
a 1000 mg POMx capsule costs me a little less than a buck a day.
 
ed
age: 55
PSA on 12/09: 6.8
gleason 3+4 = 7
HT, BT and IGRT
received 3rd and last lupron shot 9/14/10
2/8/11 PSA <.1, T= 6 ng/dl

Jerry L.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 3055
   Posted 2/18/2011 12:23 PM (GMT -6)   
I thought pomegranates were a fruit.

F8
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 3800
   Posted 2/18/2011 12:40 PM (GMT -6)   

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 2/18/2011 1:55 PM (GMT -6)   
It is Jerry. I think he meant if you had to choose between buying regular fruits/vegetables or pomegranates, you would be better off as a well rounded diet to buy the regular fruits and vegetables.
Age: 58, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 7 of 7 Positive, 40-90%, Gleason 4+3
open RP: 11/08, on catheters for 101 days
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos marg
Incont & ED: None
Post Surgery PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, 8/6 .06 11/10 Not taking it
Latest: 6 Corr Surgeries to Bladder Neck, SP Catheter since 10/1/9, SRT 39 Sess/72 gy ended 11/09, 21 Catheters, Ileal Conduit Surgery 9/23/10

Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 2/18/2011 2:26 PM (GMT -6)   
Purgatory said...
It is Jerry. I think he meant if you had to choose between buying regular fruits/vegetables or pomegranates, you would be better off as a well rounded diet to buy the regular fruits and vegetables.
 
Correction:  you would be better off to include pomegranate juice in your otherwise well-rounded diet of other fruits and vegetables.

F8
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 3800
   Posted 2/18/2011 2:43 PM (GMT -6)   
i'll spend my buck a day on a 1000 mg POMx capsule rather than, say, a fuji apple.  my point is the financial argument is weak.
 
ed
age: 55
PSA on 12/09: 6.8
gleason 3+4 = 7
HT, BT and IGRT
received 3rd and last lupron shot 9/14/10
2/8/11 PSA <.1, T= 6 ng/dl
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