A drug for treating prostate cancer has been linked with increased risk of dementia, study finds

[url]https://www.businessinsider.com/prostate-cancer-drug-dementia-treatment-linked-alzheimer-higher-risk-adt-2019-7

Great, just great!!!

A poster on another PCa site noted there are a number of reputable studies showing no association between ADT and dementia. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

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Part I
2015 (Age 54) PSA: 20.8
Bx: All cores G7 (4+3)
RALP & Adjuvant RT
Pathology: G8 (4+4)+5
PSA nadir: 0.1, steady increase until 2019: 64

Part II
2019, March: Lupron/Xtandi, PSA: 0.036

It's not as bad for ya as PCa.

mattam said...
Do you lose your eyebrows on Lupron? Mine seem to be thinning. My facial hair is definitely coming in slower.

I did not lose significant hair until the taxotere came into play. I've been on Lupron for years.

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Moderator - Prostate Cancer
(Not an MD )
DaVinci 10/09
IGRT journey (2010) -
https://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=35&m=1756808
HT (Lupron) 9/12-3/13, 6/14 to present
Prolia 6-mo inj 12/12 to present
Casodex 12/14, end 3/15
Zytiga 4-7/15 Xtandi 4/16-8/17
Taxotere 10/17-1/19
Jevtana 1/19-4/19
RT - T12,L3,4,5 mets 9/18, 5/19

or you can just die from PC.

Life is a long list of horrible choices.

---

I'll be in the shop.
Age 59, 52 at DX
PSA:
4.2 10/11, 1.9 6/12, 1.2 12/12, 1.0 5/13, .6 11/13,
.7 5/14, .5 10/14, .5 4/15, .3 10/15, .3 4/16, .4 10/16, .4 5/17, .3 10/17 .3 4/18, .4 11/18
G 3+4
Stage T1C
2 out of 14 cores positive
Treatment IGRT - 2/2012

What is funny is the article says a DRUG causes dementia. ADT is not a drug. Androgen deprivation therapy is a therapy which uses a multitude of drugs. No discussion of age groups or any other pertinent information. Poorly written article. Just goes to show you that the ordinary public have no idea what those of us on ADT face.

Really hate this half *** reporting.

Mike

kmclark1 said...
ADT is not a drug. Androgen deprivation therapy is a therapy which uses a multitude of drugs.

OK, man...whatever you say! But methinks thou doth protest too much.

I read every word of the article. It all seems correct to me with one minor exception listed below in the summary bullets, which were probably created by the editor, anyhow. And, that relatively minor error could be fixed by flipping two words:

Here's the incorrect statement:
* "The study of more than 150,000 men found a link between the degenerative diseases and a treatment drug called androgen deprivation therapy."

Here's a corrected version of the statement:
* "The study of more than 150,000 men found a link between the degenerative diseases and a drug treatment called androgen deprivation therapy."

Better now? Looks to me like a acceptably-written article, but an editing error...but like I said previously, the information is not "new news."

Post Edited (Blackjack) : 7/11/2019 3:03:03 PM (GMT-6)

I am already forgetting things and I'm not even on ADT. What was the OP's question??

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Robotic RP 3-11, GS 7 (3+4), PSA 12
Stage T3a, N1, MO, EPE, Negative Margins & SV, 1 of 16 LN +
PSA Undetectable until 11-14
PSA 11/14 0.07
PSA 2/17 .336, PSADT 15 mos., Negative Axumin Scan
PSA 7/17 .441 Started 6 mos. neoadjuvant ADT Casodex 50 mg. and Avodart .05 mg daily
PSA 8/17 .110 Whole Pelvic SRT 37 treatments
PSA 10/17 <.008
PSA 2/18 <.008
PSA 5/18 <.008
PSA 8/18 <.008
PSA 12/18 <.008

cancer causes cancer

---

I'll be in the shop.
Age 59, 52 at DX
PSA:
4.2 10/11, 1.9 6/12, 1.2 12/12, 1.0 5/13, .6 11/13,
.7 5/14, .5 10/14, .5 4/15, .3 10/15, .3 4/16, .4 10/16, .4 5/17, .3 10/17 .3 4/18, .4 11/18
G 3+4
Stage T1C
2 out of 14 cores positive
Treatment IGRT - 2/2012

mattam said...
I particularly dislike the euphemism "hormone therapy." Makes it sound like you're getting a bonus, rather than having something taken away.

Blackjack said...
...they think they are "on hormones" (the very commonly used phrase), as if it were a supplementation process, rather than hormone deprivation. Amazing.

This is my greatest peeve as well. There needs to be a better name for HT. In conversation I refer to it as "hormone depletion". Often I simply refer to it as "chemo" though those (i.e., women) who have had cytoxic chemo may protest us guys using the term.

When I mentioned to my wife's mother that I had lost all my body hair, she asked, "shouldn't just the opposite be happening?" No matter how much we may offer in the way of explanation, the misconception seems to be ingrained in everyone's minds.... that we are merely on testosterone supplements.

On occasion, a well meaning wife who posts on behalf of her husband will refer to his "HRT" because that is the common treatment for menopause. But people laugh when I mention "manopause" and I've even been told that I am getting a taste of what ALL women experience.

*/rant off/*

---

2014-15: PSA's 9, 12, 20, 25, Neg DRE's, false neg TRUS biopsy
6/16: New Uro, MRI Fusion biopsy, 6 pos Rt Base (15-40-100%) G8(4+4)
8/16: DaVinci RP, 3 foci EPE, PNI, 11 LN-, 53g, 25% Gr4, BL SVI, pT3b
1/17: Started Lupron ADT, PSA's ~.03
5/17: AMS800 implant, revised 6/17
8/17: 39 tx RapidArc IMRT (70 Gy)
1/18, 4/18, 7/18, 1/19: PSA's <0.008, T=9
2018: Dx Radiation Colitis & other weird stuff

kmclark1 said...
What is funny is the article says a DRUG causes dementia. ADT is not a drug. Androgen deprivation therapy is a therapy which uses a multitude of drugs. No discussion of age groups or any other pertinent information. Poorly written article. Just goes to show you that the ordinary public have no idea what those of us on ADT face.

Really hate this half *** reporting.

Mike

Anything written on the business insider website is suspect. Most written as clickbait.
I also wondered what to call ADT, ended up just saying chemo as a shortcut in those conversations that are casual or not important. Chemical castration perks it up also ;)

---

Shall we play a game?
2014 64 yo positive DRE on physical PSA 1.9, biopsy 2 cores 3+3=6
AS with biopsies 2 cores 3+3 PSA 2.5 2016 and 2017.
2/2018 PSA 2.7 3+3, 4+3’ 4+4 one core in apex. 9 cores out of 12 positive.
3/28 one year Lupron, MRI, Bone Scan, CT all negative. SpaceOar and fiducials done.28 IGIMRT 70Gy 50Gy pelvic, SV. 12/18 PSA .01 T18

Post Edited (LifeCointosses) : 7/13/2019 11:54:14 AM (GMT-6)

kmclark1 said...
What is funny is the article says a DRUG causes dementia. ...

Really hate this half *** reporting.

Mike

Mike, I re-read the article for the 3rd time. The article does not, in fact, appear to say "a DRUG causes dementia," or that ADT causes dementia, or that anything else causes dementia. You are critical of the reporting; what about the reading?

The important message that the article DOES SAY is that the risk of dementia (and Alzheimer's) increased with men on ADT, and further increased with increasing dosage. "Increased risk" is entirely different than "causes," and it is a reckless mistake to confuse these. Famous phrase you should learn: correlation is not causation (helpful link). The reporting on this important point was accurate; your reading/understanding of it was wrong. (Blame the hormone deprivation drugs.)


Regarding your apparent strong disdain for references of Lupron as a "drug," methinks thou doth protest too much. All PC hormone therapies come in pill form or injections. They are prescribed medications. If you want to throw a hissy-fit about a lower level of detail than that, go ahead...that's not a battle worth engaging in, frankly.

BTW, you also referred to your hormone therapy in the same way in your preceding post: "Since I started ADT I have been on seven drugs as part of my ADT."


The study looked at "elderly" men, because by far the majority of men (not all) with advanced PC and on Lupron are "elderly" (over 65).


"Chemical castration" describes some of the ADT "drugs," but not all of them. I like the term "hormone deprivation therapy" (or "drugs") as the best overall catch-all phrase...key word to include is "deprivation."

Post Edited (Blackjack) : 7/16/2019 3:41:24 PM (GMT-6)

BTW, I'm fine with Business Insider's reporting. It has been independently found to be "High" for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record. Healthcare is a big business. If you prefer other words to cover the same published report, 2 days before this thread was started, HWPC member bobbiesan started another thread titled ADT link to dementia in large study of older PCa men (currently on Page-2) on the same topic. Bobbiesan linked to an AP article.