If prostate only produces lubricant, then why incontenence

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samadabad
New Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 11/24/2007 7:11 PM (GMT -7)   
Most of the reading I have done on role of prostate, most all publication say the main thing prostate does is to provide lubricant for sperm. So no one says it also controls bladder.
 
So I just do not understand why removing the prostate cases incontenence.
 
I like to hear from friends on this matter.
My thoughts; the only expalnation I can think of is, the muscles around the prostate perhaps presses against the prostate and is provides contenent.
Now that the prostate is removed there is a space between the muscle and until some tissue growth fill the gap there will be incontenance.
 
I also read that a doctotor in the east cost offers a new procedure that while they perform Devinchi Robatic, he re-arranges some of the muscles that within a short time 4-12 weeks continance is gained based on 49/50 patitents. Any one elase has read about this?
 
When I asked my Dr. he Said with or without the new DR./east cost procedure the contenence is achived about 4-12 weeks after surgery.
 
Thx,
VE 

kw
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 883
   Posted 11/24/2007 8:13 PM (GMT -7)   

    No Dr. here but from what I can remember the prostate supports the area where the external sphincter is located.  When it is removed you loose this support.  The pelvic floor muscles are supposed to step up and take over.  In my case the muscles are weak and the hip area muscles are too tight to let the pelvic floor muscles pull where they should.

    Hopefully someone smarter than me will answer back soon.

    Remember....there are no dumb questions.....we are all here to help each other.

    KW


    43
    PSA 5.7 - Discovered during Annual Physical with Family Practice Dr.
        Biopsy Sept. 27, 2006 - Diagnosis Sept. 29 - 3 of 12 positive (up to 75%) all on left side of prostate, Gleason 7
        RRP on Oct. 17, - Nerves on right side saved.
    All Lab's clear.  No Cancer outside prostate
    Cathiter in for 28 days due to complications in healing. Removed Nov. 9, 2006
    First Post op PSA on Dec. 11, 2006  Undetectable 0.00
    Office visit on Jan. 19th due to continued excessive urine leakage.
    Feb.20th Cystoscope and 2nd Post Op PSA. Another 0.00.....:)
    Dr. said everything looks fine.  Continue to work Kegeal's. Leaking appears to have improved  after Cystoscope?!?!?!  Down to 3-4 pads per day!
    March 1st  Leaking has crept back up to 6 - 8 pads a day ??????? 
    March 29th Collagen injection into sphincter / bladder neck area to control excessive leaking.  Worked for a couple of days then back to leaking.
    April 17th (Six Months Post Op) 2nd Collagen Injection to control excessive leaking.  Leaking started back next day at work!
    May 14th Second Opinion about my leaking and Options at OU Medical Center.  After reviewing my records the Dr. feels I will probably need some surgical intervention to stop my leaking.  But did agree to try Bio-Feedback and work hard on the Kegeal's first!
    May 30th Follow up with my Dr. and 3rd Post Op PSA 0.00 agian!!!
    June 1st Start Bio-Feedback to try to control my leaking.
    Oct 17, 2007 1 year Post Op - Still fighting moderate / Severe incontenance. Using 4-6 pads a day.  Erections usable....sometimes!...Better with 100mg Viagra
   


lawink
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 621
   Posted 11/24/2007 10:08 PM (GMT -7)   
Also, the trauma caused to the ureter when it's separated and reattached to the bladder - healing takes time -- this with the lack of support KW talks about is what causes the trouble. Also, our doctor explained that men have two muscles that control urine flow -- the main one is no longer there and the kegals are needed to get the second and previously unused one strong. He said women only have the ONE muscle and that's why they often have continence problems after menopause and kegals of course help us women as well.

;o) Linda & Bob
Bob (61) - Laproscopic Prostate Removal Sept 27, 2006.
2 of 12 malignant biopsy samples - gleason 3 + 3 = 6.
 
Pathology - cancer completely contained, even a second more aggressive, previously undetected cancer)
PSA UNDETECTABLE Nov 2006, Feb, May, Oct2007.  ONE YEAR!!!! WHOOO HOOOO! 

Bob also has two secondary conditions -- Polycythemia (elevated red & white cells & platelets) and . . Myelofibrosis) -- If anyone has experience with or information on these, please email us.


bluebird
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2006
Total Posts : 2542
   Posted 11/25/2007 4:07 PM (GMT -7)   

tongue  Hi ~ VE,

 

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Cedar Chopper
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 432
   Posted 11/25/2007 7:30 PM (GMT -7)   
VE,

My (armchair reading) understanding is that in men there is a consciously controlled valve where the prostrate intersects with the urethra (for ejaculation) that controls urine flow through the urethra.
This is the muscle Linda & Bob -aka Lawlink described that only men have.
This consciously controlled valve is removed with the section of the urethra that is encased by the prostrate.

My understandiong of urethra reattachment research (as done Dr. Tewari as mentioned by Chas036 and by other teams not yet published) does not suggest there is more muscle being utilized in the reattachment -
   - but rather less trauma to both the remaining urethra and it's reattachment suturing -  
       and less trauma to the unconsciously controlled valve at the base of the bladder.
This unconsciously controlled bladder valve is supported by and encouraged to open and close by activities of your pelvic floor ("kegel") muscles. (The beads from that argon machine are unsurpassed KW!)

Keep Kegeling!

Your friend,

CCedar
ICTHUS!
2 Years of PSA between 4 and 5.5  + Biopsy 23DEC06 
Only 5 percent cancer in one of 8 samples.  +  Gleeson 3+3=6
Radical Prostatectomy 16FEB07 at age 54.
1+" tumor - touching inside edge of gland.  + Confined:)
Pad Free @ 14 weeks.  Six Month PSA <.003  :)
At 6 months, ED treated with Pump Exercises & 50mg Viagra Daily
Texas Hill Country FRESH Produce Department Manager
Have you had your 5 colors today?


uncledan
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 120
   Posted 11/26/2007 7:54 PM (GMT -7)   
If I understand it correctly there are two muscles ( sphincters ) before the operation and only one remains after. Therefore the Kegal exercises are very important to help stop the leaks. there are several links to the correct way to preform the exercises,however I can't remember them at this time, maybe some of the others here can help. Good luck, positive thinking are a great help. God Bless, Uncle Dan
Age 67
No symptoms, DRE negative, 10 - 06 PSA 5.44, 01 - 07 PSA 6.47
5 - 07 CT and Bone scans negative, 05 - 07 Biopsies, 2 of 6 positive
Gleason Score (3+4) 7 Stage T1c
08 - 14 Dr. Dasari - Baptist Hospital, Nashville da Vinci RAP, five hours surgery
Some right nerve and all left nerve removed,
Hospital discharged 8 - 16
Pathology report Negative margins, Encapsulated, 50% left side
Lymph nodes 2 R & 1 L - Negative, R & L seminal vesicles - Negative
Gleason changed (4+3) 7 closer to 8 than 6
9 - 26 Great PSA 0.000, 9 - 27 Starting on meds for ED
10 15 Dry most of the time, occasional leak (dribble )
10-27 Received pump started use on 10-29 can see resulted, enlargement.
11-22 Viagra, Lavitra no help yet, Pump still not producing usable results either.
11-28 Will discuss 2nd PSA results with surgeon

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