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rijssel
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 91
   Posted 12/31/2006 12:43 PM (GMT -6)   
I read "The Mindbody Prescription" telling myself the pain is not there does not work for me. I don't have suppressed anger and conscious or unconscious wish for pain.
When I get pain in knees, back, arm or another part my body. It is because of some physical activity or strain I caused to myself. What works is exercise, stretching those muscles and visiting a chiropractor. For GERD if I don't eat, I don't chest pain. It is not something my unconscious wants to have happen.
 
Is riverotter the only one who believes in this stuff?
 
 

imalukatic
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 12/31/2006 1:12 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm 50/50 on this topic. I do believe to a large degree that alot of some people's conditions are related to their mind-set, but in some cases it's purely physical. I learned that first-hand recently. I've been battling Leaky Gut, Candida, and acid reflux the last four months. The acid reflux is no longer an issue. The Leaky Gut is alot better. But the Candida's been very stubborn and difficult to stabilize to the point of complete healing, and it contributes largely to my Leaky Gut condition. So as long as I have Candida, I won't feel/become completely well. Then last week we discovered something surprising and unexpected in our home. We live in a rather damp climate and just moved into our current home in June. We didn't realize that it came with a mold problem due to heavy condensation on the windows. So now that it's alot cooler outside, mold has become an issue where the condensation gathers. Since it's been cleaned up, and now there' a dehumidier in place to control the moisture in the house...I improved immensely in just under 48 hours. I haven't felt this good in months. You can hardly attribute my recent surge of wellness to anything else but the resolution of the mold problem, that was obviously aggravating my Candida situation. My previously coated tongue looks almost completely normal today for the first time since my health problems started about four months ago. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

friendlygal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 722
   Posted 12/31/2006 5:52 PM (GMT -6)   
imalukatic said...
I'm 50/50 on this topic. I do believe to a large degree that alot of some people's conditions are related to their mind-set, but in some cases it's purely physical. I learned that first-hand recently. I've been battling Leaky Gut, Candida, and acid reflux the last four months. The acid reflux is no longer an issue. The Leaky Gut is alot better. But the Candida's been very stubborn and difficult to stabilize to the point of complete healing, and it contributes largely to my Leaky Gut condition. So as long as I have Candida, I won't feel/become completely well. Then last week we discovered something surprising and unexpected in our home. We live in a rather damp climate and just moved into our current home in June. We didn't realize that it came with a mold problem due to heavy condensation on the windows. So now that it's alot cooler outside, mold has become an issue where the condensation gathers. Since it's been cleaned up, and now there' a dehumidier in place to control the moisture in the house...I improved immensely in just under 48 hours. I haven't felt this good in months. You can hardly attribute my recent surge of wellness to anything else but the resolution of the mold problem, that was obviously aggravating my Candida situation. My previously coated tongue looks almost completely normal today for the first time since my health problems started about four months ago. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
Hi, imalukatic...I had a SEVERE mold problem so I can relate to that!  I read somewhere that mold can cause indigestion so I'm wondering if it contributed to my gERD!  I know that it gave me chronic sinusitis/rhinitis before.  Thank G-d I no longer have that!  But I sometimes wonder if it had something to do with my GERD.  My cat swallowed a ton of saliva constantly when the mold was there.  Then he got congestive heart failure and died from it (he was 17 which made him more susceptible.  but he certainly wouldn't have died if I didn't have the mold problem).  I do believe that the improvement of your mold condition is what has made you better.  I'm glad about that!  Bye the way, could you tell me what the symptoms of leaky gut are?  I am wondering if I have that...

riverotter
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 41
   Posted 1/2/2007 1:54 PM (GMT -6)   
Sarno is not for everybody, nor for every ailment. He has helped thousands, but thousands more think he is a nut and a quack.

Rijssel, thanks for reading the book. Are you sure that you don't have any buried anger or sadness? You seem pretty sure of that, but I think everybody has some of these emotions buried away. How are you immune?

Sarno says that your pain is real and is serious; he just says that it is not always caused by anything physical because other people have the same physical conditions, but no pain. Your pain/symptoms may be your mind trying to distract you from painful emotions. (Allergies may have a psychological element, too, since it is an auto-immune response.)

If I had chronic back pain, I would run for the Sarno treatment to avoid back surgery and because it is all about pain management. GERD is definitely trickier since taking pills isn't too bad (if it works) and progressive GERD is scary. Unfortunately, GERD treatments seem to be failing more and more people, which makes me think that the best option longterm may be to treat the mind and hope that the body will cure itself -- mind-body medicine is the wave of the future, not drugs. But that is just my opinion.

friendlygal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 722
   Posted 1/2/2007 2:33 PM (GMT -6)   
riverotter,
 
hi!! happy new year.  do you think that sarno's approach can help with vigorous GERD??
 
friendlygal

sillylilly
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 317
   Posted 1/2/2007 10:25 PM (GMT -6)   

Friendlygal,

From reading your posts, it sounds like you have LPR which is the knot in the throat feeling and you don't have burning in the chest, right?  As sincere as I think Riverrotter is, the Sarno technique is very dangerous for GERD people because we may do alot of damage to our esophagus by not keeping the acid down.   Just going off the meds, as least for me, I experience excruiating burning in my chest...it wouldn't take long to do alot of damage while I was trying to convince myself that it was all psychological, which I don't think mine is; I pretty much know why I have it, which is another story.   I gave it a try but it didn't work for me.  There is another person who posts, WDC, and she says it has worked for her. Danie's method worked for her.   

At least we have hope when we hear about people who have cured themselves one way or another. 

Happy trails,  Sillylilly


friendlygal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 722
   Posted 1/2/2007 11:08 PM (GMT -6)   

sillylilly,

thanks for your post.  I do get burning in my chest.  But, for me, the knot in the throat is at such an accelerated level that it bothers me the most.  The meds don't work for it, AT ALL. I also get tons of gas lately.  I am wondering if I already have a lot of damage to my esophagus or that I am on the way to doing so since the meds don't work. Is LPR, itself, the most dangerous, or no?

As far as stress goes, everyone has it.  And I don't want to think that the stress that I have has to go away before this does.  Because, mine right now might not go away. I want the meds to cure this already on their own!!

I had a very bad day today with this GERD, sorry to vent!  I am usually very positive and relaxed.  But today is a terrible day.   I am getting stressed about what to eat and what not to eat!  If I go alkaline, there is not much food to eat!!  I get confused about how to cure this!!  I hope that I will finally get a GI that can cure me.  I have yet to have a GI!!  i went to one that I had to fire for being a jerk and not caring about me one bit.  So now I have an appointment at another office, with the nurse practitioner there since the GIs there are booked (it's a way in).  I hope this is a good place.  I heard it was...

 


WDC
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 1/3/2007 1:32 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi friendlygal,

I'm sorry things are not going well for you. I can "hear" the frustration in your voice. Like you, my throat symptoms were the most bothersome. I don't think that LPR is necessarily the "most dangerous," but it is true that the larynx is much less tolerant of acid than the esophagus, so a little acid can do a lot of damage.

As far as stress goes, I don't believe that it has to go away in order to no longer be a factor in your condition. Lord knows, I'm in the middle of preparing a house for the market and anticipating changing my life dramatically, and it causes me lots of stress! I'm learning to deal with it better - to let myself feel and examine my emotions - and it has surely helped me. All feeings give you energy; it's just a case of channeling that energy in a positive or negative direction.

I hope finding a doctor you have confidence in will help. Sometimes the uncertainties and fears we have about our health can make us feel even worse!

Hang in there,
WDC

friendlygal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 722
   Posted 1/3/2007 3:35 AM (GMT -6)   

thanks, WDC...

I actually usually know how to handle my feelings quite well.  i don't want to get into it now, but for now i am dealing with something very big and, I really don't want to feel that it can make my GERD worse if I handle it wrong...I didn't necessarily get GERd due to anxiety in the first place.  Now I am handling something about a very stressful breakup.  The other person is very unbearable.  I know that, no matter how well I handle it, it will be negative on my mind because of him and his issues, not mine.. and there is not much I can do about it right now.  It is a long story, as I say.  And, i do not want to feel like it can make my GERD worse!!  No matter what!  As I am doing the best I can and have to sit this one out..


sillylilly
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 317
   Posted 1/3/2007 7:57 PM (GMT -6)   
Yes, Friendlygal, you need a doctor just for some assurance of what you have and what to do. There may be some other kind of drug for LPR that will work for you. I know that Danie had your symptoms and I'm sure you've read her story and how she cured herself. I know the alkaline diet is not much fun. I've lost about 9 pounds since September.

I know how you are feeling about this condition and WDC said it right; we don't feel well and the worries about this condition make us feel even worse. I am usually very outgoing and social but I haven't been seeing my friends or even calling anyone very much...this condition makes you feel very isolated because social things usually center around eating. I don't feel like exercising like I used to because if I bend over or do crunches, the acid comes up. I do try to walk and do my eliptical machine. I also had a very bad day today; the meds are not working very well at all, definately not 24 hours like the ads say they do.

I'm sorry about your cat and I know how attached we can get with our pets. I have two cats also and they are my babies; even when they sneeze, I get concerned. Seventeen years is a long time to have your cat with you, so I hope you find another one to take his place when you feel better. That might be just the thing to perk you up again.

Hang in there,
Sillylilly

friendlygal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 722
   Posted 1/3/2007 8:32 PM (GMT -6)   

sillylilly,

thanks so much for everything.

Oh, the overwhelming stress actually didn't just have to do with my cat.  I actually, somehow don't think about the cat stuff as much these days.  it was a bad break up with someone else on top of everything else (it was all going on at the same time)...

BUT...when I tried the alkaline diet it didn't work for me because part of the reason I have reflux is because I wasn't eating enough.  And when I tried the alkaline diet I still wasn't eating enough...maybe I need to try the DGL licorice more often, it sounds like that played a key factor in helping DANIE...

I am trying not to isolate myself as much and go out with friends...I was social on New Year's, and it had been a while...I even sometimes feel that if it is stressful to be on an alkaline diet, it might be better not to be on it...

Bye the way, I know that we are not supposed to drink tea...what about HERBAL tea?  What have you heard about that?

friendlygal

 


Lonibel
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 145
   Posted 1/3/2007 9:11 PM (GMT -6)   

Since we're venting, VIEW IMAGE I will tell about my New Year's experience.  We came out of a church service at 9:00 p.m. to an impromptu FEAST people had brought in.  Arroz con gandules, several dips with chips, corn bread, chicken - oh so many things that I was starving for.  You can tell:  it's several days later and I'm still thinking about it!  I was the only one in the hall not eating.

I, too, think that part of my problem is not eating enough, and when I'm on whatever diet, I actually develop "food phobia";  Is it on the list?     I rush all day picking at the few foods I can throw together to have at work, and then the only time I can really eat is at night when my digestion slows down.  It often becomes a choice of eating or sleeping - you know what I mean.  If I don't give 3-4 hours of not eating before bedtime, I can't lay down for the coughing...

Happy New Year, friends.


sillylilly
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 317
   Posted 1/4/2007 5:49 PM (GMT -6)   

I believe you could be on to something about not eating enough.  If you are producing some acid, and having symptoms, maybe you do need something in your stomach for the acid to work on.

It's just horrible to have to pass up a wonderful buffet like that after church.  Sometimes we have to say just live alittle for today.  I did this yesterday and ate barbequed meatballs and curried rice at a friend's house knowing that I would probably pay for it later and I did.  But, chee weez, it's worth it sometimes just to be able to feel like a normal person. 

Cheers,  Sillylilly


sillylilly
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 317
   Posted 1/4/2007 5:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Oh about the herbal tea. I've been drinking a combo of Ginger Aid tea and Camomile tea. Also, just bought some Fennel tea to add to the mix. It is very soothing for the esophagus and tummy. Also, I've been taking cayene pepper that I put in a capsule and swallow. All of these remedies seem to help...I don't know if it's a placebo effect but it works, so who cares.

nomoregerd
New Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 6
   Posted 1/5/2007 9:57 PM (GMT -6)   
riverotter said...
Sarno is not for everybody, nor for every ailment. He has helped thousands, but thousands more think he is a nut and a quack.

Rijssel, thanks for reading the book. Are you sure that you don't have any buried anger or sadness? You seem pretty sure of that, but I think everybody has some of these emotions buried away. How are you immune?

Sarno says that your pain is real and is serious; he just says that it is not always caused by anything physical because other people have the same physical conditions, but no pain. Your pain/symptoms may be your mind trying to distract you from painful emotions. (Allergies may have a psychological element, too, since it is an auto-immune response.)

If I had chronic back pain, I would run for the Sarno treatment to avoid back surgery and because it is all about pain management. GERD is definitely trickier since taking pills isn't too bad (if it works) and progressive GERD is scary. Unfortunately, GERD treatments seem to be failing more and more people, which makes me think that the best option longterm may be to treat the mind and hope that the body will cure itself -- mind-body medicine is the wave of the future, not drugs. But that is just my opinion.
 
Riverotter,
 
I owe you a load of thanks!  You have changed my life positively.  I was newly diagnosed with GERD when I read your posting about Mind/Body and Dr. Sarno a few weeks back.  I've never had heartburn but my Xray showed I had acid reflux and my trouble swallowing came from this.  My doctor told me that I would need to be on the MEDS for the rest of my life, which did not go over too well with me. 
 
I'm currently reading Dr. Sarno's book and doing a workbook to help me with the whole Mind/body process. Some of it is hard to swallow, no pun intended, however, I am trying to keep an open mind.  I'm still having trouble swallowing but understand that this may not be a quick and easy solve for me. I am committed to changing my mindset and not letting my insides become a wreck.  If these books don't cure my GERD, I know that I will still have a lot of positive to gain from this experience because I am not letting my future emotions ruin my health and life. 
 
I can not thank you enough for your postings. They have motivated me so much.  I am on this road to recovery because of you!!!!
 
Many Thanks!!!!!

WDC
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 1/6/2007 9:34 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi nomoregerd,

Just a note of encouragement - when I started using mindbody techniques for my LPR (like GERD, but the acid affects the larynx, not the esophagus, and sounds like what you might have, too), the difficulty in swallowing was definitely the last symptom to go. It took several weeks. But I almost immediately got over the coughing, gagging, and breathing difficulties.

As I read the posts of people who have been on meds for ages, with really no improvement, I think a decision to get off of them however you can and as early as possible is a smart one. For some of us, Dr. Sarno's methods really work.

Good luck,
WDC

nomoregerd
New Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 6
   Posted 1/6/2007 3:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks WDC! That does make me feel a lot better. I'm not giving up on it. I refuse to stay on the MEDS unless it is total 100% necessary and I believe it is not.

Good luck to you as well.

riverotter
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 41
   Posted 1/11/2007 3:37 PM (GMT -6)   
Here are my thoughts on recent comments in this thread. (I've been away from the forum for awhile as it can induce relapse of symptoms for me.)

Sarno does not say that GERD would be caused by stress per se. He points to subconscious emotions. Anger and rage mainly, that are buried inside. The nice thing about his treatment suggestion is that, to begin, you only need to acknowledge that buried anger may be causing you some distress; you don't need to stop all stress or be all happy. This approach short-circuits the brain's whole reason for giving you symptoms. That is why some back sufferers experience almost instant relief.

This is similar to when you go to the doctor with, say, a pain in your ear and once checked out and the doctor says nothing is wrong, the pain goes away as you leave the office. I'm sure some of you have experienced this: once the doctor says, "don't worry," the pain disappears. It is weird, but it happens. The same can happen with a doctor saying, "oh my, you have a dangerous ailment," and your pain goes up. The condition has not changed, in these examples. Your brain's perception of the condition has.

When I read this forum I hear lots of woe and misery. How many people on the forum ever go see a counselor or psychologist (perhaps on your own nickel), to talk about your life, its ups and downs? I suggest that some of you give yourself a present and spend $300 on 3 $100 sessions with a psychologist and say, "I'd like to talk about my emotions -- anger, sadness -- because they may be affecting my health." Imagine doing that.

I hear people trooping to doctor after doctor, but how many of you ever troop once to an emotional or spiritual person? There is an epidemic in this country of chronic ailments. Some are related to environmental factors (mold, pollution, toxins), but some are related to our being out of touch with our body-mind world. We go see too many doctors and not enough shrinks. IMO.

Whether you go to a shrink or not, I suggest anyone who is sufferering alot read Sarno or one of the similar people (Amir, Sopher, Schechter).
At the same time, do work with a physician until you are better. Don't drop your meds until you have fully understood the Sarno method and even then taper them off. If I have a flare-up, I have found it helpful to meditate on anger/sadness once a day, take action to reduce new anger, if possible, get plenty of rest, good food and exercise. Once you feel better, celebrate with foods / drinks on the bad list, knowing that the bad list was probably more a mental trigger than anything else. Your body is tough. It will heal if you let it.

[Lest I forget, another nice book is by Thomas Moore, Care of the Soul: read the chapters entitled "Honoring Symptoms as a Gift of the Soul" and "The Body's Poetics of Illness"]

take care everyone and use what works for you !

riverotter
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